Problems with multiple calling lists: OCM 7.2

[RC]

We are running Outbound Contact Manager 7.2 and run multiple calling lists in a campaign; according to the literature this is a built in capability and we can customize the call list weights. When we run multiple lists though we appear to get database locks which causes records to go in "retrieved" status but never get called. As result the buffer of retreived records grows all day long and those records never get called. Has anyone run into issues using multiple call lists and is there a configuration or database remedy that corrects the problem?

[cavagnaro]

Me, it was a bug and had to do an upgrade of OCS.

[RC]

What did you upgrade to and did it completely resolve the issue? Our DBAs are struggling to find out the cause, but keep hitting a brick wall.  How many multilple calling lists are you using concurrently? Is there a limit?

[Cuore_2003]

Hi RC.

I'm agree with cavagnaro but,
1) Have you consult genesys support? It “smells” a product bug
2) [i](Sorry for this question)[/i] Have you set correctly list weights? Perhaps there is some configuration error. Try with two or three calling list first.
3) Can you explain your outbound platform? In my experience outbound 7.2 works (more or less) fine except with CPD in ASM way.

BR and good luck!

[RC]

Genesys support has been heavily involved, but they can't figure it out... the official line is "don't use multiple lists". I'm curious if anyone out there is using OCM with multiple lists sucessfully; if so, how many lists do you run concurrently, do they all access the same database; have there been any issues? If it's a bug, then I would think other folks would be experiencing this issue, but Gensys isn't telling us others have reported this; so maybe it's the way our database is configured, or something else we're missing. But we get database deadlocks A LOT, and suspect that's what causes records to go in a retrieved status but never get called; interestingly, the audit logs don't show those records getting retrieved, but in OCM you can clearly see they are...  a real puzzle and it means that we don't completely call some of our targeted customers because randomly these records get 'stuck'.

[Fra]

[quote author=RC link=topic=3839.msg16665#msg16665 date=1234440479]
But we get database deadlocks A LOT, and suspect that's what causes records to go in a retrieved status but never get called; interestingly, the audit logs don't show those records getting retrieved, but in OCM you can clearly see they are... 
[/quote]

That's weird, cause OCS creates two store procedures per campaign, one which retrieves the records, one which determines the max record id for its campaign list; so I can't really figure out how you can see records in 'Retrieved' status in OCM without logs showing that..do you have an OCS log to post and in that case could you mention one of those records?
Are your calling lists shared across different campaigns?

Fra

[cavagnaro]

Agree with Fra, unless you did what some "smart" users like to do, create tables by themselves and not allowing OCS to do the job as should be by OCM.

[Fra]

[quote author=cavagnaro link=topic=3839.msg16672#msg16672 date=1234446258]
Agree with Fra, unless you did what some "smart" users like to do, create tables by themselves and not allowing OCS to do the job as should be by OCM.
[/quote]
we'll send Pavel's poodles to bite those users 

[cavagnaro]

"poodles from hell...attack my childs" lol

[RC]

I don't have access to the audit logs, but they've been shared with Genesys and they could not determine the cause; we spent an entire day with all the traces turned on and DBAs watching; we confirmed we had deadlocks and we confirmed records showed as 'retrieved' but did not appear in the logs. We sent a dozen or so screen shots showing the 'retrieved' records, exported the rsl files and have demonstrated that a call list will pull records into a retrieved status mid morning and at the end of the day it still never gets called. Our architecture is MS Sql Server; not sure if we have a configuration issue or not.  We only run a single campaign, but have several calling lists in it. Each list accesses the same database table, but each list contains unique records.  Do any of you use OCM with multiple calling lists? If so, how is that campaign configured and how are your tables configured?

[cavagnaro]

[quote author=RC link=topic=3839.msg16694#msg16694 date=1234474003]
Each list accesses the same database table, but each list contains unique records. 
[/quote]

How is that possible? Each calling list should have its own Table access where you define the DBServer used and the table name. So if 3 calling lists share same table in DB means you only have 1 table access? What is the idea of this configuration?

[Dionysis]

From my experience you absolutely can't have 1 table with multiple calling lists.  You can have 1 format, but they need separate tables.

I have an environment with anywhere up to 30 campaigns running simultaneously, all with at least 2 calling lists, and have never had database locking problems as you've described.

[cavagnaro]

I have a campaign with 11 calling lists and no problems at all.

[Fra]

[quote author=cavagnaro link=topic=3839.msg16698#msg16698 date=1234486274]
[quote author=RC link=topic=3839.msg16694#msg16694 date=1234474003]
Each list accesses the same database table, but each list contains unique records. 
[/quote]

How is that possible? Each calling list should have its own Table access where you define the DBServer used and the table name. So if 3 calling lists share same table in DB means you only have 1 table access? What is the idea of this configuration?
[/quote]
Well, I would never do that, but Genesys states you can, from the Outbound Contact Deployment Guide:
[i]
"Each table in the database requires a separate Table Access Point object.
The Table Access Point object is a property of the Calling List
object in Configuration Manager. One or more calling list objects can share the
same Table Access Point object.".
[/i]
Dangerous cause you have got to have dialing filters which split the DB table in subsets that are supposed to have different unique records.
RC, your issue is not about having multiple calling lists, rather the fact you have many calling lists using the same database table. Instead, have the dba create two DB tables, then create two Table Access Points associated with two calling lists. Add them to your campaign and let us know if you still face any deadlock.
Without logs is anyway really hard troubleshooting.

Fra

[Dionysis]

I would avoid having the dba create the tables.

Much safer to do it using OCM, then you're guaranteed the tables will accurately reflect the format required by the OCS.  It's definitely possible to do it directly, I just think it's preferable to use OCM.